I think an actor's longevity depends on their ability and/or screen presence plus the movies they star in. If a great actor does one big film and then lots of art house stuff, he won't be remembered by the masses. It's a difficult one this... what one thing links all the big stars who've been famous for over 2 decades?

The one actor toady who I'd like to see in movies for a good few years yet is Ewan McGregor. Has he got what it takes to be an icon of cinema? Who knows.

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by Lori
Ewan McGregor. Has he got what it takes to be an icon of cinema?

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Wow, that's a good choice. He clearly is one of the most talented young actors of out time. He's appeared in Trainspotting (already a cult film), but in my poinion, if he was remembered, above all it would be for his role in the Star Wars Trilogy, because it's so huge, even though it wasn't flexing his acting muscles.

But would he stay famous, or would he be famous? Men, more than women can last a long time in movies, since men's looks are less important than women's.

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by Lori
what one thing links all the big stars who've been famous for over 2 decades?

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Hmmm.... gonna think on that one, will get back to you.

Okay, had a thought (I know, better have a drink and lie down to rest)

Lori asked me what links all film stars who've been around for over two or three decades. Here's who I thought of...

Dustin Hoffman
Robert DeNiro
Al Pacino
Danny DeVito
Michael Douglas
Goldie Hawn
Sean Connery
Robert Redford
Jack Nicolson
Meryl Streepe
Diane Keaton
James Wood
Gene Hackman
Glen Close
Harrison Ford

This is just a quick list, sorry if I forgot someone, BUT if I did, does that mean they're still very famous, even though they didn't spring to mind?

Now what connects them? Very little All but Harrison Ford and Glen Close have oscars. Glen Close has had many nominations though. All but James Woods played the main character in movies when they started out, now Glen Close, Gene Hackman and Dustin Hoffman play supporting charaters like Wood.

So I think only two things really connect them: Luck and Franchise. They have all been part of a famous franchise movie or 'cult film'. How they became part of that is the 'luck' factor. Do you think Harrison Ford would be famous if he hadn't been in Star Wars? How did he get it? He was George Lucas' carpenter = LUCKY. DeNiro and Pacino had the Godfather Trilogy. Connery had Bond, Nicolson had China Town and One Flew Over The Cooko Nest. DeVito had 'Taxi' and so on...

Any ideas? Thoughts?

P.S Age also is a common factor, well DUH!

Slight Tangent, but i'd have to say Nicolson's defining role was The Joker.

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by KieranFrost
Now what connects them? Very little

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I know... odd isn't it. Perhaps it's the same with actors as with everyone. It's not what you know but who you know. Get the right scripts and the right parts and you're made.

Interesting subject.

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by Maffrew
i'd have to say Nicolson's defining role was The Joker.

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What?!?!

No way, he'd already won TWO oscars before then, was already one the highest payed actors in Hollywood (still is) and had been in The Shining, Little Shop of Horrors, Easy Rider, China Town, Prizzi's Honour, the Witches of Eastwick. All 'cult movies' in their own right. I even looked this up, he'd done 37 movies before he did Batman. Hell, he wouldn't have got the role if he wasn't that famous.

The Joker was a good role, definatly a big blockbuster and will stay famous for many, many years (if the original Batman movie is anything to go by), BUT it was NOT his defining role.

I'd've thought his role in Godfather 2 was one of de Niros less famous. Taxi Driver, Raging Bull, King of Comedy, The Deerhunter..

A few more that spring readily to my mind -
Paul Newman, Martin Sheen, Harvey Keitel, Dennis Hopper, Jeff Bridges, Clint Eastwood, Marlon Brando, Christopher Walken, Sigourney Weaver, John Travolta, Michael Caine, Catherine Deneuve, Jack Lemmon

Certainly, many of them have been in roles or films that have become 'iconic', that are well known even by people who've never seen the original movie. But really, the main thing all these people have in common is that they're still working in the industry.

As for actors whose fame has lasted after they died, here's a few that I can think of..
Charlie Chaplin, Buster Keaton, Groucho Marx, John Wayne, Errol Flynne, James Dean, James Stewart, Katharine Hepburn, Cary Grant, Ingrid Bergman, Orson Welles (although not primarily for acting, of course..), Alec Guinness, Peter Sellers, Dirk Bogarde, John Gielgud, Yul Brynner, Marilyn Monroe

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by KieranFrost
(quotes)

What?!?!

No way, he'd already won TWO oscars before then

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Oscars don't mean poo.

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by KieranFrost
(quotes)
The Joker was a good role, definatly a big blockbuster and will stay famous for many, many years (if the original Batman movie is anything to go by), BUT it was NOT his defining role.

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Your thread is about Fame and Time, not acting ability or Oscars or what he gets paid. As far as fame goes, blockbusters are what makes it, and i think if you said 'Jack Nicolson' to the general public, they would say 'Joker' back.

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by Maffrew

Your thread is about Fame and Time, not acting ability or Oscars or what he gets paid. As far as fame goes, blockbusters are what makes it, and i think if you said 'Jack Nicolson' to the general public, they would say 'Joker' back.

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Young public, maybe, though I'm still not sure about that. Jack Nicholson's career has certainly slowed down and the bulk of his career and his most famous roles belong to decades before the consciousness of the latest generation of movie-goers who have yet to see those films.

Dan: a minor point: Katharine Hepburn ain't dead She's very much alive at 90+ years of age

One thing that strikes me about many of the names mentioned is versatility. Most have played a wide range of roles convincingly and in most cases that is the key to holding the attention of the cinema going public. we get bored easily

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by Maffrew
and i think if you said 'Jack Nicolson' to the general public, they would say 'Joker' back.

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If you said Jack Nicolson to me I would say "Oooh ooohh Heeerreeesss Johnny!!" cos The Shining to me is the defining Jack film.

Also Ford getting the part in Star Wars wasn't luck but a scam by Gary Kurtz, producer of Star Wars. He wanted Ford to play Han Solo but Lucas has/had a policy of not recasting people in differnent movies and he'd already worked with Ford on American Graffiti. Kurtz knew that Lucas was looking for a carpenter and that Ford could do the job so he persuaded Lucas to give Ford the job then Kurtz coached Ford in certain mannerisms which would fit the character and got him to walk about George's house with a hammer tucked into carpenters belt which was around his waist...it hung kinda low and looked like a holster and was done to subtley make Lucas think what Ford would be like playing the character. Also as auditions were being done at the house Ford could see what the competition ws doing. It worked because Ford got drafted in at the last minute to join one of the ensemble groups and the rest is history. Taken from Lucas's biography.

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by Keenangel
Dan: a minor point: Katharine Hepburn ain't dead She's very much alive at 90+ years of age

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Oops.

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by Milky
(quotes)
Also Ford getting the part in Star Wars wasn't luck but a scam by Gary Kurtz, ... and the rest is history. Taken from Lucas's biography.

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ooooooo check Mr. Information interesting story though. i'm well impressed

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by Maffrew
oscars don't mean poo

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Yes I agree, oscars don't mean poo They mean possible leverage in negotiations, they mean something to put on the posters of movies, they mean big bucks in America. People may not agree with who wins and such, but oscars do give your career an extra boost, therefore you stay in movies a bit longer and therefore you are famous a dash longer too. So oscars are a important part of this discussion

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by Sydney
One thing that strikes me about many of the names mentioned is versatility. Most have played a wide range of roles convincingly and in most cases that is the key to holding the attention of the cinema going public. we get bored easily

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In most cases that's ture, BUT some manage to survive by doing the opposite, playing a certain kind of role and perfecting it so the audience always know what they're getting. Julia Roberts, Sandra Bollock, Al Pacino (to a certain degree), Goldie Hawn. Loads perfect a 'style' which then means if a role comes up fitting their 'style' they will get handed the job on a platter. Julia Roberts, who I think was amazing in Erin Brochovic, had basically been perfecting that role of 'tough yet in need of protection' since the start of her career. It's kept her going and gained her an oscar to boot.

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by In A State Of Dan
Oops.

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To save Dan a tade of embarrasment, I thought she was dead too. She should really fire her PR guy

On the versatility issue, there's often a distinction made between 'character actors' and 'stars'.

The former are generally more versatile, less likely to get leading roles, and sometimes overlooked because of that even though they're actually better actors. There's also the method acting thing, which I suppose is related.

'Stars' generally play variations on the same character and are almost always instantly recogniseable. Sean Connery, for example, is the same in almost every film he's ever been in - he doesn't even bother to do accents even though very few of the characters he plays are actually Scottish. Others who I'd say fall into this category - Tom Cruise, Harrison Ford, Arnold Schwarzennegger (another one for the list - he's had a pretty long career) and most of the big action stars, etc.

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by KieranFrost
(quotes)

To save Dan a tade of embarrasment, I thought she was dead too. She should really fire her PR guy

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Perhaps she's had enough, wants to stay out of the public eye and doesn't want that fame to last?

Yeah, that's pretty much it.. she's gone into virtual seclusion. I know she also suffers from Parkinson's Disease too.. but she hasn't appeared in a film for a while now.

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by In A State Of Dan
and most of the big action stars

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Ah, BUT will they survive the test of time? Arnie might, possibly Stallion, but I think Van Dame won't, as will most other 'hard core' action stars. Like those in westersn (old action movies), they ain't famous now. Save Eastwood, maybe John Wayne, but not due to films, because he was an icon. People hear weston, they think John Wayne.

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by Bryany
doesn't want that fame

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doesn't...want...fame...? I'm sorry the phrase is lost on me