I think the troubled start you mention is the cause of its cancellation

I only saw the unaired pilot, but it was simply not enough to get me into it It didn't grab me enough to make me seek out any more or ask for the next episode to be shown at Sanctuary wher eI see most of my spoiler eps.

I think the studios expect classic episodes right from the get go these days and that with things like character development impossible in the space of 42 minutes, the possibility of a perfect episode is just about zero

I think we've ridden the crest of the wave on sci-fi/fantasy shows for now, and it'll take the next Buffy to rejuvenate the scene like BtVS did singlehandedly 6 years ago.

I really didn't like the pilot I saw at Nos, but I saw some later episodes & I thought the show had potential.

Ah well

---

by MonSTeR
I think the studios expect classic episodes right from the get go these days

---

Oh, I don't think it's that. They really don't care about the quality of the episodes, it's the ratings that matter. Firefly was getting lower ratings than Dark Angel in the same timeslot.. But Fox kept messing about with the running order, promotion, from what I've read, was pretty much non-existent (and, ironically, the episode which airs tonight is apparently being trailed more heavily than before), in some places it was shown at different times without warning, etc.. When they're investing millions of dollars in a show, you expect better treatment than that, but there you go.

One can only hope that this means we get Joss and Tim back to work full-time on Buffy and Angel. The latter in particular sure does need it...

Oh yeah, I think we're in agreement there, I think I was trying to imply that the classic episodes were the ones that would give them theire sky-high viewing figures, rather than were plot driven. Kinda based on the assumption that those with plots would get the most figures (if you see what I mean)

From the episodes I've seen of Buffy so far it's going very very well, but I really think that Angel needs some help. It's gone from cool supernatural detective series to a camp melodrama along the lines of Home and Away but with a jolly vampire and singing green guys...

I don't know how they'd get out of it, but I think that's maybe a topic to start in the "spoilers and rumours section" hint hint

And here's what Joss had to say. Again, don't have a link for this, I just found it on usenet.

---

joss - Dec 13, 2002 7:49:36 am EST #7717 of 7737 Mark
Kiba owes me her life.

Four AM. Can't sleep. Who'd have thought?

There's a couple of things I'd like to say. And a few things I really
can't. First of all, I'm prouder of this show and the people I worked with
on it than I can express in words, monkey noises, or hyroglyphics. I
believe this has been some fairly great TV. And the experience of making
it... I've had crew members who've been working for 20 years say they've
never worked around such excitement, support and love. You walk on that
set, you're transported. The cast: 9 count 'em 9 incredibly talented actors
who are all decent, wonderful people. This phenomenon cannot be explained
by science.

Second of all, don't think for a second that I have given up on this show.
I think it has been mistreated shamefully, but the Fox network has
indicated that they would not stand in the way (which they can) of my
finding a new home for the show. That's no easy prospect. But I will do
everything in my power, as always, to keep this bird in the air. Of course
I'll post if there's any news.

But even if the show goes back up elsewhere, I'm going to lose a good
portion of my crew. Production will halt, they'll need to find new jobs.
You can't imagine how that feels. How much they brought to the table, how
hard and well they worked. And their Christmas bonus is this. As much as
the cast, the staff, and my not so secret lover Minear, I honor those guys,
and hope to get them back on board.

So for now, I proudly take my place beside Profit, The Ben Stiller Show,
the Tick, and Action. But I won't rest until I've found safe harbour (no,
not the Gregory Harrison show) for this vessel.

I've got the time.

It ain't like I'm sleeping.

-joss.

---

So maybe there is hope? I certainly, um, hope so.

(Edited by In a State of Dan 13/12/2002 17:20)

---

by MonSTeR
Oh yeah, I think we're in agreement there, I think I was trying to imply that the classic episodes were the ones that would give them theire sky-high viewing figures, rather than were plot driven. Kinda based on the assumption that those with plots would get the most figures (if you see what I mean)

---

Ah, gotcha. Well, to be honest, I think there were some classic episodes - most notably 'Out of Gas'. The show was/is getting good reviews, and even Fox seemed keen on where it was headed, but it didn't seem to help any as far as actually getting people to watch it.

I really, really hope this can find a home somewhere. The show has got very good, the cast work well together. last weeks ep (cant remember the title) was brilliant.

Bugger, I havent even seen an ep yet

Firefly really doesn't deserve this!

I didn't really like this show, although admittedly I didn't watch very many eps. I don't really gert that much chance to watch TV in an evening and so I tend to miss all the good ones that get cancelled.

FireFly.... hmm, what can I say? Wel when I saw the first aired ep (Train Job) I was a bit disappointed as I was not expecting the wild west with a space slant. Then I watched another few eps (purely through knowing what Joss can do from seeing Buffy & Angel), I started to enjoy it & really look forward to it. I got my hands on a very bad quality pilot which did a heck of a lot of explaining of the characters & how they got together to crew the Firefly. It was a real turning point, although not dripping with action it served it's purpose & made you familiar with them all & how they interacted.

Then the most outstanding ep in my mind 'Out of gas' simply blew me away, I laughed, I cried, I beat my hands on the computer desk in disbelief (don't worry, I won't spoil ) & now another show bites the dust just as I was caring about the characters & what happened to them, watching their moral struggles & dilemas. I just hope that Joss can find another station to give the show a chance.

---

by Velvet Glove
I just hope that Joss can find another station to give the show a chance.

---

Not sure it'll be the same without all the original actors/actresses.

Why wouldn't they get them back? They're probably still under contract if/when 'Firefly' returns.